That would be either 3 of 6 or 2 of 5, depending on how you treat Texas. If you treat it as one state contest combining the primary and caucus, she lost. If you treat it as two state contests, she won one and lost one.

Defiantly NOT a hero

Hillary still isn't close enough to obama to say she's winning. At best, she's keeping her head above water.

Not that it really matters....Hillary is staying in the race to the bitter, bitter end. This nomination fight will be decided on the convention floor (and by some back room deals). Hillary could still win the nomination.

this just in!

obama has declared his vice presidential pick.

Weaver95: Hillary still isn't close enough to obama to say she's winning has a chance to win. At best, she's keeping her head above water.

ftfy. she certainly can't say she's winning, because she isn't in any regard.

I have been recently informed that Wyoming is one of the most lovely states in the US.

I'm sure that the 'Clinton momentum' thing is a sick parody of some sort.
/I get jokes

burndtdan: Weaver95: Hillary still isn't close enough to obama to say she's winning has a chance to win. At best, she's keeping her head above water.

ftfy. she certainly can't say she's winning, because she isn't in any regard.

except "most of the big states"
and "most of the blue states"
and "most of the states that start with the letter C"

you can spin anything when given the words "in any regard".

/gobama

This seriously got greelighted? I mean I get jokes too, but perhaps the spiffy tag has bested me in this one. It seems serious, and yet TFA says it cannot be serious since its a link to an Obama win. Should I laugh? Or should I add some serious comment?

/Laugh
//Although she is clearly not winning
///Beer me!

brimstoner: //Although she is clearly not winning

I just wanted to say this again. I am also puzzled by the greenlight, because as satire goes.. it's not. I mean, I "get it", but no.

Repeat headline?

/still worth a +1

burndtdan: ftfy. she certainly can't say she's winning, because she isn't in any regard.

I think Bill and Hillary are pulling in every last favor, using ever last threat and blackmailing everyone they can think of to get positive coverage of Hillary's campaign. Bill is going to make whatever shady deals he needs in order to get enough money to buy Hillary the nomination. Then they'll kick McCain in the 'nads and steal the white house.

And then it'll be time for Bill and Hill and all the droogs to get ready for a bit of the old ultraviolence....

Weaver95: burndtdan: ftfy. she certainly can't say she's winning, because she isn't in any regard.

I think Bill and Hillary are pulling in every last favor, using ever last threat and blackmailing everyone they can think of to get positive coverage of Hillary's campaign. Bill is going to make whatever shady deals he needs in order to get enough money to buy Hillary the nomination. Then they'll kick McCain in the 'nads and steal the white house.

And then it'll be time for Bill and Hill and all the droogs to get ready for a bit of the old ultraviolence....

Well obviously Bill wants her to be president. It would be a boon to his sex life. He of all people knows how busy the president is, so he knows that she'll be too busy to pay attention to him.

Good grief! How much longer do we have to endure this pissing contest between these clowns.

Hey Democrats. Flip a coin already.

The numbers just nudged a bit in Wyoming.

Obama - 61%
Clinton - 38%
100%

Someone break out that list of states won by more than 60%.

T. Dawg: www.dracobaby.com

i only hope that your "will win" prediction in pennsylvania is wrong.

/in pennsylvania.
//will NOT be voting for Clinton.

Kenny B: Good grief! How much longer do we have to endure this pissing contest between these clowns.

Hey Democrats. Flip a coin already.

It is going on longer then it should, but that's because Hilldog has an outside chance of winning on a technicality (or cheating, depending on what happens and how you look at it) and she won't just concede defeat.

The difference between her and Huckabee is that Huckabee wanted to keep a dialogue of conservative issues going, and I really think he enjoyed the attention.
Hillary would rather kneecap her own party (and, in my view, the future of the nation) then accept a loss.

I have a question. I don't know how to phrase it so that it doesn't sound sort of elitist, but here goes: I keep hearing that Obama does well among highly educated people. Why don't uneducated/less educated people follow their lead? Don't they have educational aspirations for their kids if not themselves?

Empanda: Obama - 61%
Clinton - 38%
100%

Wow, how funny.. if you reverse that then Hillary would have won by how much she would have needed to have caught up a little.

As far as the timing goes, people need to remember that primaries didn't even used to start until March- moving them up has been a pretty recent thing. So all this "Oh noes, we don't have a candidate yet" thing is, I feel, unwarranted at this juncture.

SilentStrider: T. Dawg: www.dracobaby.com

i only hope that your "will win" prediction in pennsylvania is wrong.

/in pennsylvania.
//will NOT be voting for Clinton.

It's not MY map - it's Hillary's. You can tell by the delusional scrawling of the hearts ;)

PocketfullaSass: I have a question. I don't know how to phrase it so that it doesn't sound sort of elitist, but here goes: I keep hearing that Obama does well among highly educated people. Why don't uneducated/less educated people follow their lead? Don't they have educational aspirations for their kids if not themselves?

Because everyone knows everything when it comes to politics and the nations future.

FWIW I agree with you to an extent. But I'd say Lou Dobbs knows more about politics then the average neurosurgeon. Who is more educated on paper, though? And would you vote for someone because Lou Dobbs or the neurosurgeon did?

Education doesn't always translate into other aspects of life.

PocketfullaSass: I have a question. I don't know how to phrase it so that it doesn't sound sort of elitist, but here goes: I keep hearing that Obama does well among highly educated people. Why don't uneducated/less educated people follow their lead? Don't they have educational aspirations for their kids if not themselves?

we've spent decades discouraging trust in all things intellectual. If someone is smart, we're told that they're up to something not good. We don't want intelligent leaders, we want the all american football jock, the ace fighter pilot, the tall and thin basketball star, the good old boy...we don't want smart guys in congress and we don't want them in the white house.

vincentpriceisdead: As far as the timing goes, people need to remember that primaries didn't even used to start until March- moving them up has been a pretty recent thing. So all this "Oh noes, we don't have a candidate yet" thing is, I feel, unwarranted at this juncture.

It's only a big deal because McCain now has time to focus on rallying the GOP base, instead of fighting for the election.

I Said

I see your point. Tons of people are better educated than me, and I wouldn't take advice from most of them.

I Said: It's only a big deal because McCain now has time to focus on rallying the GOP base, instead of fighting for the election.

The flip side of that is that the Dems have almost total saturation of the media so the names keep staying out there while McCain's working his BBQ Sauce recipe.

It really could go either way. McCain has a huge uphill battle because by selling out to the GOP it made him that much easier to attack as well as degrade his appeal to moderates, which will be critical for him to win.

I Said: It's only a big deal because McCain now has time to focus on rallying the GOP base, instead of fighting for the election.

Meanwhile, on the other side, Hillary is going to tear the Democrats apart trying to beat Obama to the nomination.

Obama can (and probably will) win the popular vote....but Hillary will reject that as any sort of meaningful measure of sucess. She's gonna win the nomination any way she can, which at this point means buying off the superdelegates and fixing the convention votes. That she might destroy her party in the process is irrelevant - she's in this to win.

Weaver95: she's in this to win.

I really hope Howard Dean sits them both down, hooks her to a thorazine drip, and talks some sense.

vincentpriceisdead: The flip side of that is that the Dems have almost total saturation of the media so the names keep staying out there while McCain's working his BBQ Sauce recipe.

Unfortunately, in politics, there is such a thing as bad publicity. And the longer this goes, the more likely it is that someone makes a terrible mistake in the heat of discussion or gets irreparably damaged by a successful attack.

It really could go either way. McCain has a huge uphill battle because by selling out to the GOP it made him that much easier to attack as well as degrade his appeal to moderates, which will be critical for him to win.

Right. But, as you said, the coverage is on the dems. He can get a way with quite a bit now at meetings, like the CPAC one, that many independents will never hear about. He has to walk a fine line, but I don't think he's in too much trouble doing it.

Weaver95Obama can (and probably will) win the popular vote....but Hillary will reject that as any sort of meaningful measure of sucess. She's gonna win the nomination any way she can, which at this point means buying off the superdelegates and fixing the convention votes. That she might destroy her party in the process is irrelevant - she's in this to win.

While I think you hit the nail on the head, in terms of what Hillary would try, I do not think she'll be successful. The DNC wants to win, but they also don't want to piss off their establishment guys (which is her entire campaign). I would think there are a lot of meetings right now discussing how to get her to concede defeat in the next few weeks (before Denver)without alienating her support.

Obama is the stronger candidate. It's not just his supporters who know that. Republicans know that and Democrats know that. It's now a matter of trying to reason with the ego and ambition of HRC.

/Sorry for the Tolstoy.

tomasso: That would be either 3 of 6 or 2 of 5, depending on how you treat Texas

Yup.


(bored with "This.")

Weaver95: I Said: It's only a big deal because McCain now has time to focus on rallying the GOP base, instead of fighting for the election.

Meanwhile, on the other side, Hillary is going to tear the Democrats apart trying to beat Obama to the nomination.

Obama can (and probably will) win the popular vote....but Hillary will reject that as any sort of meaningful measure of sucess. She's gonna win the nomination any way she can, which at this point means buying off the superdelegates and fixing the convention votes. That she might destroy her party in the process is irrelevant - she's in this to win.

She's going to TRY to buy off superdelegates and seat MI/FL, no doubt. But keep a few things in mind.

Dean certainly knows what sort of irreparable damage a backroom nomination would do to the Dem party. He also knows a Clinton presidency means he is no longer the head of the DNC. He'll be fighting against it for all he's worth.

I get the feeling most of the undecided supers don't want to see a fractured party either. They may suspect that Obama, not the Clintons, is the future of the party.

Obama has an unprecedented ground level organization that is already threatening the jobs of any elected supers who overturn the will of the voters. Clintonian promises are for naught if they get voted out of office.

Call me an optimist, but barring a Clinton blowout in PA, I think Obama has this one wrapped up.

Jubeebee: Call me an optimist, but barring a Clinton blowout in PA, I think Obama has this one wrapped up.

Hillary could easily get that Pennsylvannia blow out. Ah, the joys of corrupt big city machine style politics....which is exactly what we've got in Pennsylvannia.

I could see the party leaders throwing the election to Hillary (they're easily bought after all) and Hillary staying in the race.

Weaver95: I could see the party leaders throwing the election to Hillary (they're easily bought after all) and Hillary staying in the race.

What do you think is worth more money to the leaders?

a) Having one of their own win the general election

b) Whatever money Hillary can pay

I'm going with "b". They make more money with Barrack as POTUS then they do "selecting Hillary" as the nominee.

I Said: I'm going with "b" "a". They make more money with Barrack as POTUS then they do "selecting Hillary" as the nominee.

I FAIL.

There's absolutely no way they'll seat FL and MI as is. If they did they have would have a major revolt on their hands as well as probably a mass exodus from the party. I think they're gonna end up just splitting the delegates and being done with it because otherwise someone's gonna have to pony up the dough for it.

I Said: Weaver95: I could see the party leaders throwing the election to Hillary (they're easily bought after all) and Hillary staying in the race.

What do you think is worth more money to the leaders?

a) Having one of their own win the general election

b) Whatever money Hillary can pay

I'm going with "b". They make more money with Barrack as POTUS then they do "selecting Hillary" as the nominee.

I think it would be a mistake to underestimate Hillary. She's amoral, ruthless and won't quit. I believe she will do whatever it takes to secure her nomination....and I believe the pennsylvannia democrat party organization is corrupt enough to be bought.

vincentpriceisdead: There's absolutely no way they'll seat FL and MI as is.

last i knew, the plan was that, if FL and MI want delegates counted, they have to redo their primaries, at their own cost.

vincentpriceisdead: There's absolutely no way they'll seat FL and MI as is. If they did they have would have a major revolt on their hands as well as probably a mass exodus from the party. I think they're gonna end up just splitting the delegates and being done with it because otherwise someone's gonna have to pony up the dough for it.

I don't think they'll split them 50/50. That's far worse for them then saying they don't count.

Weaver95: I think it would be a mistake to underestimate Hillary. She's amoral, ruthless and won't quit. I believe she will do whatever it takes to secure her nomination....and I believe the pennsylvannia democrat party organization is corrupt enough to be bought.

I would never underestimate her. But even bribing. Penn. won't seal the deal.

I wouldn't underestimate Romney, a mormon republican who got elected in Mass. with more money then god. But where is he?

They fact that super delegates haven't already swung heavily for her (excluding those that did before the primaries) means, IMHO, that she doesn't have the influence we all thought she did anymore. The Dems want to win more then they want to please Hillary.

SilentStrider: last i knew, the plan was that, if FL and MI want delegates counted, they have to redo their primaries, at their own cost.

I think there was also an issue as to whether they would be primaries or caucuses. I don't know what they're gonna do, but I do know it won't just go forward as is like Clinton wants it to.

Obama helped Foster win Denny Hastert's old seat tonight. He picks up a superdelegate and shows the Dems he has coattails. That district has been Republican since 1974 according to one report.

Weaver95: Jubeebee: Call me an optimist, but barring a Clinton blowout in PA, I think Obama has this one wrapped up.

Hillary could easily get that Pennsylvannia blow out. Ah, the joys of corrupt big city machine style politics....which is exactly what we've got in Pennsylvannia.

I could see the party leaders throwing the election to Hillary (they're easily bought after all) and Hillary staying in the race.

Obama's from Chicago. He knows all about big city machine style politics, and so do a lot of his most ardent supporters. He has six weeks to let his organization churn in Philly and Pittsburgh, and the polls there are much, much closer than they were six weeks before the TX/OH primaries. So far, we've seen him close the polls by about 10% per week of dedicated campaigning.

It's way too early to call PA one way or the other. But even if he loses, if he keeps it within single digits, Clinton has nowhere else to move the goalposts.

Jubeebee: It's way too early to call PA one way or the other. But even if he loses, if he keeps it within single digits, Clinton has nowhere else to move the goalposts.

Don't underestimate her ability to move the goal posts. Every time I start thinking she can't go any lower, she does.

Empanda: Don't underestimate her ability to move the goal posts. Every time I start thinking she can't go any lower, she does.

That Hillary, she picked up a mean Limbo on her Carnival cruise.

/let's get lower now.. how low can you go?

Empanda:
Don't underestimate her ability to move the goal posts. Every time I start thinking she can't go any lower, she does.

No doubt she keeps lowering the bar.

But NC is too black, Indiana is too close to Illinois, Oregon is too educated, West Virginia and Kentucky are too Red, and Montana and South Dakota are too small. So none of those states matter.

Puerto Rico might matter, but that's in June. That's a long time for her to sing with her fingers in her ears and her eyes shut.

Jubeebee: But NC is too black,

Honestly, NC is not a gimme to the GOP and they really really need to stop thinking of it like that. Sure, there's a lot of Bible Thumpin Southerners here, but like you said there's a lot of Black folks and a lot of "Get Off My Land" White Southerners, too, and they ain't too happy with the people in charge right now.

I'm actually kinda hoping it goes until May, just because I'd like my primary vote to matter for once.

Jubeebee: Puerto Rico might matter, but that's in June. That's a long time for her to sing with her fingers in her ears and her eyes shut.

If that's what it takes, then that is what she will do.

i'm starting to realize that nothing - NOTHING - is going to force hillary to drop out of the race. For a while there I thought that she might get a stern talking to from party insiders...but they're unwilling or unable to muster the will to force Hillary into a compromise with Obama. The idea of Hillary stepping down on her own out of some sense of the greater good is so alien a mindset to a Clinton that I don't even consider that a possiblity.

So it's looking like we're in this for the long haul. But it's been a strange, crazy ride so far and circumstances could still arise that force Hillary to bow out of the race.

vincentpriceisdead: I'm actually kinda hoping it goes until May, just because I'd like my primary vote to matter for once.

I'm amazed that mine's going to matter.
Of course, since PA is the only one in April, we're going to get a LOT of visits from both candidates.

Weaver95:
If that's what it takes, then that is what she will do.

i'm starting to realize that nothing - NOTHING - is going to force hillary to drop out of the race. For a while there I thought that she might get a stern talking to from party insiders...but they're unwilling or unable to muster the will to force Hillary into a compromise with Obama. The idea of Hillary stepping down on her own out of some sense of the greater good is so alien a mindset to a Clinton that I don't even consider that a possiblity.

So it's looking like we're in this for the long haul. But it's been a strange, crazy ride so far and circumstances could still arise that force Hillary to bow out of the race.

You might be right that she won't drop out on her own. But if she loses PA, the Dem leadership might find their collective testicles and threaten her Senate seat if she doesn't.

I'm waiting for live coverage of Howard Dean and Al Gore dragging Hillary off a stage while she clutches a microphone, screaming, "I have the 3am foreign healthcare experience to change the 90s!! Yes we will!"

And Mark Penn is off telling some reporters, "Hillary and the Democratic leadership have never been closer. The momentum is on her side."

It's a humble dream, but it's my dream.

Jubeebee: I'm waiting for live coverage of Howard Dean and Al Gore dragging Hillary off a stage while she clutches a microphone, screaming, "I have the 3am foreign healthcare experience to change the 90s!! Yes we will!"

That would be the number one clip on the youtubes for years to come.

Empanda: Jubeebee: I'm waiting for live coverage of Howard Dean and Al Gore dragging Hillary off a stage while she clutches a microphone, screaming, "I have the 3am foreign healthcare experience to change the 90s!! Yes we will!"

That would be the number one clip on the youtubes for years to come.

I'm pretty sure that if Hillary doesn't get to be president that she's going to require hospitalization.