The Twin Towers collapsed after Muslim extremists flew two passenger-loaded jets into them on Sept. 11, 2001.

Oh my God, did anyone else hear about this?

Etchy333: Oh my God, did anyone else hear about this?

No, but I heard something about the reverse vampires initiating a controlled demolition...

kronicfeld: No, but I heard something about the reverse vampires initiating a controlled demolition...

Pardon my ignorance; what is a reverse vampire? Do they run up to you in the daytime, and squirt blood into you?

queezyweezel: Pardon my ignorance; what is a reverse vampire? Do they run up to you in the daytime, and squirt blood into you?

They CRAVE the sunlight.

Atheists/Solstice? Does not compute.

queezyweezel: Pardon my ignorance; what is a reverse vampire? Do they run up to you in the daytime, and squirt blood into you?

No, but they enjoy every bodily fluid *except* blood.

Quite icky.

I thought atheists celebrated Winter Carnival.

queezyweezel: Pardon my ignorance; what is a reverse vampire? Do they run up to you in the daytime, and squirt blood into you?

Reverse Vampires (new window)

Usually alluded to when talking about the people who are seeking the "troof" about 9/11.

noYOUare: Atheists/Solstice? Does not compute.

Outcasts from a small town that think atheism is a way to get back at their parents.

The 10-foot-tall sign - posted while the town was celebrating Dickens' Day and the lighting of the tree - pictures the World Trade Center Twin Towers with a caption from the John Lennon song "Imagine No Religion."

Blaming Islam for 9/11 is very immature and just solidifies the stereotype that Americans don't know anything about the world or history.

Etchy333: Outcasts from a small town that think atheism is a way to get back at their parents.

Yeah. That's it. Sure.

Etchy: "Blaming Islam for 9/11 is very immature"

Politically motivated terror attacks are easily possible without religion.....but what about young, well educated, otherwise normal middle-eastern doctors, engineers and students committing synchronized suicide and taking planeloads of passengers with them because they believed they would be rewarded with 72 virgins in Paradise? That just can't happen without religion, hence the sign was correct.

Etchy333: Blaming Islam for 9/11 is very immature and just solidifies the stereotype that Americans don't know anything about the world or history.

Religious furor (in this case using Islam) is to blame for the 9/11 attacks. While the actual motives were likely economic, religious fundamentalism was used to bring together those responsible for the dirty work.

9/11 was a faith-based initiative.

Kyosuke: 9/11 was a faith-based initiative.

If their religion was backed by a government with advanced military capabilities it might even be considered respectable. Sending a carrier in to take out the enemy is much cleaner than hijacking planes.

"9/11 was a faith-based initiative."

So was the current mal-administration.

Mordant: If their religion was backed by a government with advanced military capabilities it might even be considered respectable.

Unprovoked attacks are never respectable, whether they occur in New York, Baghdad, or anywhere else.

Many also are incensed that the image of a tragic event is being used to further a doctrine.

ORLY?

Mordant: If their religion was backed by a government with advanced military capabilities it might even be considered respectable.

Except we're combating militants and not targeting innocent civilians like the coward Muslims extremists do.

capecodcarl: Except we're combating militants and not targeting innocent civilians like the coward Muslims extremists do.

Dolittle, Hiroshima and Nagasaki called.

capecodcarl: Except we're combating militants and not targeting innocent civilians like the coward Muslims extremists do.

You're right America would never target civilians, like the ones in Hiroshima or Nagasaki.

Kyosuke: Unprovoked attacks are never respectable, whether they occur in New York, Baghdad, or anywhere else.

You don't think we in any way provoked the people who attacked us? Interesting.

capecodcarl: Except we're combating militants and not targeting innocent civilians like the coward Muslims extremists do.

That statement seems to dance the on the razor's edge of the truth, doesn't it? Isn't the civilian death toll in Iraqi pretty significant? I mean... sure, it isn't WWII style decimation, but still pretty damn bad. Also, when we were attacked, weren't symbolic buildings attacked and the people who happened to be in those buildings were more like collateral damage?

After all... The towers were supposed to be symbols of our power and wealth. The Pentagon was a symbol of our military strength. Although the last plane never reached it's target, we can probably agree that they were going to try and hit the White House with that one, the central symbol for leadership (outside of the President) of our country. Only two of those buildings were mostly civilian buildings (making exception for any government offices that were housed in the Twin Towers). Assuming that the White House was the third target building, that makes two military targets (White House, and Pentagon), and two mostly civilian targets. It was meant to demoralize and show our weaknesses.

I just think labeling them "Muslim Extremists" is just another way to paint them as having no motivation outside of just randomly killing people, which doesn't appear to be the case at all. These are thinking people who are intelligent, yet appear to be honestly angry at us. Don't you think it's wise for us to understand WHY they might be angry at us, angry enough to fight and die against us, instead?

In other words... trying to simply label them with some general buzz word isn't going to help anyone understand the reality of the whole situation. If more people don't understand it, it isn't going to end up being fixed. Their hands are bloody, our hands are bloody... at some point, we're going to have to figure out a way to wash the blood off and move on with our lives or this could go on, seemingly, forever.

kronicfeld: Dolittle, Hiroshima and Nagasaki called.

Don't forget Dresden!

The Atheists should counter with a statue of the FSM. Ramen.

kronicfeld: Yeah. That's it. Sure.

Okay, then can you answer my question? What does atheism have to do with the solstice?

noYOUare: What does atheism have to do with the solstice?

Nothing necessarily. It could have something to do with these particular atheists. Who knows.

JerseyTim: I thought atheists celebrated Winter Carnival.

I celebrate whiskey sales at Spec's. Makes budgeting parties much easier.

noYOUare: What does atheism have to do with the solstice?

What does a fat guy flying behind reindeer,or a pine tree with a foil star have to do with the alleged birth of Christ?

noYOUare: Okay, then can you answer my question? What does atheism have to do with the solstice?

Nothing, but it makes more sense to celebrate an annual astronomical phenomenon than the birth of a saviour we don't recognize who -- if he did actually exist as a living historical figure -- wasn't even born remotely near the date celebrated.

Oh, and for the record, Christmas is hardly a religious holiday anymore. Easter is the holiest of Christian holidays (or at least should be, as the entire faith centers around the fact that the savior died and was reborn to forgive sins), not Christmas. Christmas exists as a major festival SOLELY for commercialistic purposes.

eqtworld: Born2late: The Atheists should counter with a statue of the FSM. Ramen.

How can you be atheist and pastafarian?

Those who understand His Noodley ways are the only ones who could truly understand the answer to that question.

Bob Down: noYOUare: What does atheism have to do with the solstice?

What does a fat guy flying behind reindeer,or a pine tree with a foil star have to do with the alleged birth of Christ?

I'd be hard-pressed to find a Christian who thinks Santa has much to do with the birth of Christ, beyond the metaphorical generosity encouraged by both. However, Atheists don't believe in any of it, including pagan traditions such as celebrating the solstice.

But in my experience, fundamentalist atheism has as much to do with attention-whoring as fundamentalist Christianity, so that's probably the motivation behind this.

eqtworld: How can you be atheist and pastafarian?

Same way some people can be Christian and Republican.

jiyuu_musouka: Oh, and for the record, Christmas is hardly a religious holiday anymore. Easter is the holiest of Christian holidays (or at least should be, as the entire faith centers around the fact that the savior died and was reborn to forgive sins), not Christmas. Christmas exists as a major festival SOLELY for commercialistic purposes.

jiyuu_musouka: wasn't even born remotely near the date celebrated.

Wow. These are TWO TOTALLY NEW IDEAS. You've completely turned me around on this. That's great justification for atheist hypocrisy.

noYOUare: But in my experience, fundamentalist atheism has as much to do with attention-whoring as fundamentalist Christianity, so that's probably the motivation behind this.

Bleh...frankly, I'll take any excuse to pour rum into something, even if it is pancake batter.

noYOUare: jiyuu_musouka: Oh, and for the record, Christmas is hardly a religious holiday anymore. Easter is the holiest of Christian holidays (or at least should be, as the entire faith centers around the fact that the savior died and was reborn to forgive sins), not Christmas. Christmas exists as a major festival SOLELY for commercialistic purposes.

jiyuu_musouka: wasn't even born remotely near the date celebrated.

Wow. These are TWO TOTALLY NEW IDEAS. You've completely turned me around on this. That's great justification for atheist hypocrisy.

Never said they were new ideas. And where exactly is hypocrisy? I can celebrate whatever days I feel like for whatever reason I feel like. Hell, I've got a farking christmas tree in my house and both my roommate and I are atheists.

Or am I not allowed to celebrate anything because I don't believe in your invisible sky fairy?

/Got to keep up the stereotype, you know.

Many also are incensed that the image of a tragic event is being used to further a doctrine.

So the image of Jesus dying on a cross after having been tortured and abandoned by everyone around him was a happy occasion? Damn, Christians are more sadistic than I thought.

"I don't think any of us predicted it would have the World Trade Center there, and I'm troubled as to why somebody would want to use that image in a display trying to promote their position," Anderson said today.

I wonder if he'd vote for Rudy...

And as one resident related, if the town were to put a stop to all the displays, then the atheists win, Anderson said.

Atheists are asking to have the same treatment for everybody. How is that just the atheists winning and not all of us are now being treated equal (and thus, all of us winning)? Oh right, because the atheists are oppressing the 80% of the population in the US that's Christian. How silly of me to forget that...

Where is the aluminum pole for Festivus?

simpsonfan: Where is the aluminum pole for Festivus?

Up the ass of every Christian in that town.

Etchy333: a caption from the John Lennon song "Imagine No Religion."

Damnit, that song is in my profile.

The sign angered many residents, particularly because it was the only message erected and seemed to advertise that the town was promoting atheist beliefs.

After all, only atheists believe in the solstices.

And the best way to deal with someone expressing an opinion you don't like is to silence them in any way you can. That's really the American way.

I wouldn't support such a sign's bad taste, but if you allow Christians to do shiat like this, then in for a penny in for a pound amirite?

noYOUare: However, Atheists don't believe in any of it, including pagan traditions such as celebrating the solstice.

What exactly is there to believe about having a celebration during the solstice for an atheist? It is a holiday season, and that day is as good as any to celebrate. Or, are atheists not allowed to want to be with their families and celebrate during this season?

I personally like the solstice, and never understood what it wasn't made the first day of the year (makes sense given the changing of day lengths).

submitter: Atheists put up sign celebrating Winter Solstice in city square. Town puts a 12-foot Christmas tree in front of it

Well, the bringing-up-9/11 part of the sign seemed quite asshat-ish*, and as someone mentioned above given the season, it seems more the act of people rebelling against their parents' religions than it does the act of people who don't believe in god nor could care less about the existence of god.

Christmas trees are nice, though. :)

/apathetic agnostic atheist
// * someone could just as easily put up a Stalin or Mao Zedong sign with the same John Lennon slogan

You know, I'm an atheist, but the content of the atheist sign was assholish and designed to incense religious types.

I understand the sentiment of wanting to put something up to show people atheists are out there. They could have done something like a humorous Festivus sign or the Statue of Liberty.

But pissing people off doesn't do any good in the long run, especially us atheists who aren't interested in being combative.

JerseyTim [TotalFark] Quote 2007-12-16 05:34:35 PM
I thought atheists celebrated Winter Carnival.

Nope, I celebrate Christmas, because it's an American tradition. Shows what you bible-thumpers know. Celebrating solstices is a Pagan thing.

noYOUare:
But in my experience, fundamentalist atheism has as much to do with attention-whoring as fundamentalist Christianity, so that's probably the motivation behind this.

You don't know what the word 'fundamentalist' means, do you?

I'll give you a hint: it's a theological stance.

This is exactly why prayer in schools and government is an awful idea. Each religious tradition gets uppity that THEIR prayer isn't the exclusive prayer, so they try to outdo each other.

Well, the two funny things:

1) The mayor put a SECOND Christmas tree up in front of the "atheist" sign. But they are not blocking it.

2) Winter Solstice is actually considered a "pagan" holiday. It's not-its just the scientific name for the shortest day of the year. Other religions have "holidays" around the same time.

3) Atheist thinks it's the "holiday spirit" to blame religion for 911. Asshats

/Non-theist.
//Happy Holidays.

Onager: I'll give you a hint: it's a theological stance.

I'll give you a hint: So is Atheism.

Kyosuke: I'll give you a hint: So is Atheism.

Yes, just like not believing in astrology is a stance on the stars controlling our destinies.

kronicfeld

Both were legitimate military targets, and NOT chosen simply to kill civilians.

Additionally, Japan was an agressor nation during a period of total war, and refused calls for surrender.

As far as I am concerned, more A-bombs would have easily been justified.

kronicfeld: Yes, just like not believing in astrology is a stance on the stars controlling our destinies.

Ummm...it is. Your stance is that you don't believe the stars control your destiny.

An atheist's theological stance is that he/she doesn't believe in God.

Don't jump the gun. In this case, Kyosuke didn't seem to be saying "Atheism is a religion."

Now, on the original argument, the idea of a "fundamentalist atheist" seems kind of strange... You can't really get down to the fundamental beliefs when dealing with a lack of belief.

I think the best word to use to give the idea of a crazy, asshat atheist on the level of a religious fundamentalist might be "anti-theist" since those are the ones who are actively against religion.

IMHO.

Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, Happy Solstice, Happy Holidays. :)

/assuming any of you are willing to accept holiday wishes from a godless heathen