This is nothing a new sweater can't solve.

Wait a minute. I've been paying attention to Mexico's full blown Fascism coming up. I haven't heard much about Bolivia. Who's Leftwing and who's Rightwing down there? Columbia is Rightwing having a pissing match with Commie Chavez, what's up with Bolivia?

GaryPDX: Wait a minute. I've been paying attention to Mexico's full blown Fascism coming up. I haven't heard much about Bolivia. Who's Leftwing and who's Rightwing down there? Columbia is Rightwing having a pissing match with Commie Chavez, what's up with Bolivia?

Bolivia is all sweaters and coca leaves.
Morales is crazy and racist.
If they mattered, things would be royally screwed.

You may remember him from such quotes as "Capitalism is bad! ... Ahhh, my precious economy!" and "Oh yeah, ...well... Well, if you do that, we'll make producing your precious "Coca-cola" slightly inconvenient!" and, of course, any one of his and his family's many crazy claims about racial superiority.

So the leader of Bolivia is a Commie, of sorts. And these provinces are rebelling with a Rightwing twinge. Got it!

This is about the dominant minority versus the huge and racially distinct underclass. There is some very interesting discussion of the preludes to this in Amy Chua's book World On Fire.

GaryPDX: So the leader of Bolivia is a Commie, of sorts. And these provinces are rebelling with a Rightwing twinge. Got it!

It's a tad more complex than that.

It's almost a role reversal of the US in the 1800s.

The indigenous Indians are in power (duly elected) and are trying to regain control of the countries natural resources that have somehow fallen into the hands of european decendants. (cuz they bought the land and built the companies).

The blues eyes don't like this idea (I stole it fair and square) so they're trying to secede from Bolivia.

Remember how well secession worked here?

GaryPDX: So the leader of Bolivia is a Commie, of sorts. And these provinces are rebelling with a Rightwing twinge. Got it!

Some days I wish they sold programs.

real shaman: GaryPDX: So the leader of Bolivia is a Commie, of sorts. And these provinces are rebelling with a Rightwing twinge. Got it!

It's a tad more complex than that.

It's almost a role reversal of the US in the 1800s.

The indigenous Indians are in power (duly elected) and are trying to regain control of the countries natural resources that have somehow fallen into the hands of european decendants. (cuz they bought the land and built the companies).

The blues eyes don't like this idea (I stole it fair and square) so they're trying to secede from Bolivia.

Remember how well secession worked here?

You just described Mexico, too. The "Blue Eyes" own everything there and now they will be able to jack boot 24/7 all over the country. All that's necessary is to show up on a list, or be a gringo, or have dark eyes.

We're paying attention to religious nutballs half way across the planet and there's plenty of shiat to worry about in out back yard.

But, no worries. The all new American Idol starts soon.

GaryPDX: We're paying attention to religious nutballs half way across the planet and there's plenty of shiat to worry about in out back yard.

But, no worries. The all new American Idol starts soon.

I have it on good authority that we are not merely spectators from afar to what's going on in Bolivia and Venezuela. We're not shooting, and we're not running around in uniforms waving flags--but we're there...

Who would have thought Evo Morales' retarded wealth redistribution schemes would have a backlash?

/totally shocked

staplermofo: This is nothing a new sweater can't solve.

My buddy from Ecuador told me that whenever something stupid happens, it's perfectly acceptable to you yell 'Evo Morales!'. It's kind of like us saying 'D'oh' or something. The guy is the mockery of most of South America.

well I was wondering what legalizing cocaine would do to a country...

BravadoGT: GaryPDX: We're paying attention to religious nutballs half way across the planet and there's plenty of shiat to worry about in out back yard.

But, no worries. The all new American Idol starts soon.

I have it on good authority that we are not merely spectators from afar to what's going on in Bolivia and Venezuela. We're not shooting, and we're not running around in uniforms waving flags--but we're there...

Takes a real rocket surgeon with inside "contacts" to figure that out, jesus.

Phil Moskowitz: rocket surgeon

WTF?

Speaking of "gas wars", man, that burrito really tore me up last night.

VictoryCabal: Some days I wish they sold programs.

Who Hates Whom: Well-Armed Fanatics, Intractable Conflicts, and Various Things Blowing Up, A Woefully Incomplete Guide (Paperback)
by Bob Harris

I wonder if his buddy Chavez will send in Venezualan troops to help restore order. Much like what I see happening in Cuba when Castro dies.

Well when Evo nationalized the gas company state revenues went from 300 million a year to 3 BILLION a year. Which is being put towards crazy socialist things like education, public works, infrastructure, lifting the millions of natives in abject poverty after colonization into something more sustainable. You mean the European minority wants its gravy train of privatized natural resources back? Ain't gonna happen.

It will if they make the secession stick. And then Evo will be shiat out of luck

Shaggy_C: Phil Moskowitz: rocket surgeon

WTF?

Welcome to The Internet.

redking194: It will if they make the secession stick.

The South lost; get over it.

I'm gonna head off and watch Salvador again.. see if I can't cook up my own 'insider info' to this complex and baffling situation.

/facepalm.

redking194: It will if they make the secession stick. And then Evo will be shiat out of luck

I think thats when the wealthy former oil executives call in; Blackwater, Aegis Defence Services, Babylon Gates, BH Defence,
Centurion Risk Assessment Services, Ltd, Crescent Security Group, Control Risks Group, Diligence, LLC to fight against the Bolivian government and the Native population? I think their on their way now. I pray for the innocents that will be in the middle of rich white men killing for hydrocarbons.

This won't end well

Phil Moskowitz: I'm gonna head off and watch Salvador again.. see if I can't cook up my own 'insider info' to this complex and baffling situation.

/facepalm.

I wish I knew how to be as smug and condescending as you.

Wow, lots of communist sympathizers in this thread.

Wow, lots of tax-crazed anarcho-capitalist sympathizers in this thread.

LocalCynic: Wow, lots of tax-crazed anarcho-capitalist sympathizers in this thread.

You say that as if that were a bad thing.

So they finally did it. I was in Bolivia for two weeks this summer (one week each in Santa Cruz and La Paz). There were only two things people were talking about in Santa Cruz; Copa America and secession (green/white flags were everywhere). Meanwhile, in La Paz, everyone was staging demonstrations to get more benefits written into the constitution (undergoing revision at the time) and having a pissing contest with Sucre over which was the real capital.

I can understand the desire of the indigenous groups to get a fairer share of the natural wealth of the country (they are extremely poor up in the Andes), but Morales is going about it like an old-school Marxist and complete idiot. He nationalized billions of dollars in oil infrastructure that was almost all paid for by Brazilian companies before bothering to look at a map and realize that all that oil and gas has to leave the country though... Brazil (it ain't going up and over the Andes, and Peru and Chile already hate Bolivia anyway).

Despite the "viva Evo" graffiti I saw in El Alto, no one I met (including the taxi drivers) liked the guy, they all saw him as an incompetent Chavez lackey who is eventually going to drive the country into the ground. On a more ominous note, people I met in both cities were very nervous about the joint military exercises he was having with Venezuela (Venezuelan troops in Bolivia), which led them to reasonably suspect that any significant conflict will involve Venezuelan troops coming in to assist Morales.

The Greatest American Frampton: real shaman: Phil Moskowitz: I'm gonna head off and watch Salvador again.. see if I can't cook up my own 'insider info' to this complex and baffling situation.

/facepalm.

I wish I knew how to be as smug and condescending as you.

Oh, don't worry. You have that down pat, Wannabee.

were you raised on the Res? got a card? then STFU, punk.

I was and I do.

LocalCynic: Wow, lots of tax-crazed anarcho-capitalist sympathizers in this thread.

Care to point them out?

(cuz they bought the land and built the companies).

That's the point - they built the companies. That involves an investment that can't be revoked if you live in a society that values law and order, and respects property rights.

I'm assuming you would be in favor of canadian natives suddenly being given ownership over Canada's natural resources cause the "blue eyes" bought it, built on it and used it?

Since when is given government that kind of power a good thing? Zimbabwe tried. Didn't work so well for them.


I can understand the desire of the indigenous groups to get a fairer share of the natural wealth of the country (they are extremely poor up in the Andes), but Morales is going about it like an old-school Marxist and complete idiot. He nationalized billions of dollars in oil infrastructure that was almost all paid for by Brazilian companies before bothering to look at a map and realize that all that oil and gas has to leave the country though... Brazil (it ain't going up and over the Andes, and Peru and Chile already hate Bolivia anyway).

Thread winner.

I'm assuming you would be in favor of canadian natives suddenly being given ownership over Canada's natural resources cause the "blue eyes" bought it, built on it and used it

And of course by the natives i really mean the government.

This is not going to end well.

Harvey Manfrenjensenjen: I can understand the desire of the indigenous groups to get a fairer share of the natural wealth of the country (they are extremely poor up in the Andes), but Morales is going about it like an old-school Marxist and complete idiot. He nationalized billions of dollars in oil infrastructure that was almost all paid for by Brazilian companies before bothering to look at a map and realize that all that oil and gas has to leave the country though... Brazil (it ain't going up and over the Andes, and Peru and Chile already hate Bolivia anyway).

A+, mate. What's that old thing about getting more flies with honey rather than vinegar?

No wonder everyone from Santiago to Tijuana is trying to get to America. The whole place is one giant clusterfark.

Can we stop calling it "immigration" now and call it what it is, a "mass refugee displacement", please?

GaryPDX: Can we stop calling it "immigration" now and call it what it is, a "mass refugee displacement", please?

Does this mean you're giving up on calling it an invasion?

LocalCynic: GaryPDX: Can we stop calling it "immigration" now and call it what it is, a "mass refugee displacement", please?

Does this mean you're giving up on calling it an invasion?

Well, it's kinda hard selling it that way. But seriously, something has to change in a big way. This just can't go on forever.

There are no hot women in / from Bolivia so WTF should we care?

Wait, they have energy resources?

shiat....let's help liberate them!

GaryPDX: So the leader of Bolivia is a Commie, of sorts. And these provinces are rebelling with a Rightwing twinge. Got it!

Great. Instead of trying to figure out what is going on, try to shoehorn the whole thing into a comparison to the the seating arrangements in the French Revolution so you don't have to think.

Can't find Bolivia on a map, but I know who side I'm on by God!1! I'm with the monarchists!

My nephew is an archaeologist and something of an expert on the region. Political economic and cultural divisions between people at different altitudes has been the norm at least as long as there has been agriculture in the region.

ilambiquated: GaryPDX: So the leader of Bolivia is a Commie, of sorts. And these provinces are rebelling with a Rightwing twinge. Got it!

Great. Instead of trying to figure out what is going on, try to shoehorn the whole thing into a comparison to the the seating arrangements in the French Revolution so you don't have to think.

Can't find Bolivia on a map, but I know who side I'm on by God!1! I'm with the monarchists!

No, I'm just trying to understand game board.

GaryPDX: ilambiquated: GaryPDX: So the leader of Bolivia is a Commie, of sorts. And these provinces are rebelling with a Rightwing twinge. Got it!

Great. Instead of trying to figure out what is going on, try to shoehorn the whole thing into a comparison to the the seating arrangements in the French Revolution so you don't have to think.

Can't find Bolivia on a map, but I know who side I'm on by God!1! I'm with the monarchists!

No, I'm just trying to understand game board.

No, you simplify everything to fit inside your limited mind space. This is the problem with cognition, people aren't all created equal, in ambition or ability. That's what he's saying.

Phil Moskowitz: No, you simplify everything to fit inside your limited mind space. This is the problem with cognition, people aren't all created equal, in ambition or ability. That's what he's saying.

fe bet.

Occam's Razor is a safe bet..:)

This is much more race-based than anything that's happening in Venezuela. The Bolivian whites have been shiatting over the Quechua and Aymara for hundreds of years and now's payback time. The amount of racism there is pretty staggering, I lived in Santa Cruz (the main whitey bastion) for three years in the early 1990's and it felt like a time warp to American race relations fifty years ago in a lot of ways...

Saxiif: This is much more race-based than anything that's happening in Venezuela. The Bolivian whites have been shiatting over the Quechua and Aymara for hundreds of years and now's payback time. The amount of racism there is pretty staggering, I lived in Santa Cruz (the main whitey bastion) for three years in the early 1990's and it felt like a time warp to American race relations fifty years ago in a lot of ways...

Racism is very rampant across all of Latin America. Far worse than here.

So if a civil war does happen, we can assume the Morales govt might ask for Venezuelan troops to help him out. Now, if Chavez helps him... does that mean a regional war?