They were fined for gouging. That's not S/D. It's illeagel.

Price gouging is illegal.

In other news, that monster.com add scared the hell out of me.

And now everything is peachy.

...aaaand how many gas stations are in Georgia again? Because I know I PERSONALLY saw that many stations gouging within 30 miles of where I live...

This isn't justice, it's a scapegoat.

:/

laissez faire, laissez passer!

I bet they made a lot more than $1,000 - $10,000 gouging. Still good to see though. Now how about going after the big corporations?

...so all this money goes to the government, right?

So, explain to me, then, how your average guy, who was actually the one GOUGED, benefits from this?

Oil companies laugh at the hick governor, stop selling fuel in Georgia

/well not really
//but it would be funny
///any price above historical norms or inconsistent with a Party Mandated Profit constitutes price gouging

So the Gas Stations took money from us the consumer.
The State of Georgia charges these stations a fine for Gouging..

So when do the consumers whose money it was originally get a check in the mail? or is it one of them automatic deposite things?

So, what's going to stop the gas stations from raising prices and justifying it on paying the fine? Basically, the gas stations aren't going to pay the fine, the customers will in the end. Score one for the little guy.

Keo_74

The syndicate makes the profit. And everybody has a share.

/had to wade through the puerile undergrad anti-corporate shiat piled knee-high to get to that quote

Sometimes the Georgia government gets it right.
Now if only the governor would keep his promise and let the population vote on the flag.....


/Its heritage not hate.
//Its the truth.
///Got three ancestors buried in Tennesse to prove it.

Please tell me that enough people will spread the word and boycot these stations. Settling for something like this?

Gouging laws are so poorly written they are almost meaningless. This shouldn't be seen as a victory for the consumer but rather an admission by the gas stations that the settlement was going to cost less than fighting the charges in court.

I am sorry to see the high number of possibly foreign-born owners who did this crap though...

When they hand out business licences do you get told about acceptable pricing?

Treefox

Sometimes the Georgia government gets it right.

Perhaps, but not this time. Those fines are chump-change to those stations. Plus, the "little guy" who actually GOT gouged won't see a dime of it.

Pathetic.

the osama oil one irks me.

Last quarter the big oil companies (not the gas stations) made a profit of roughly $10 billion. Why the hell am I paying $2.09/gallon? and why aren't they being targeted for price gouging?

Once again, ignorant politicians are sticking their noses into something they know nothing about and pandering to their equally ignorant constitutents.

If they want to go after someone, they should be going after the Big Oil companies. The poor station owners make pennies per gallon and have razor thin margins. That's why they sell slimy jims, chips, and other crap.

Also, as I have said before: if I want to sell my gold for 3 times the spot price, I will. And before someone pipes up and says "gold isn't gas, we need gas..." blah blah blah, consider your car, computer, phone, window coatings, etc.

Instead of being mad at oil companies for "price gouging", why not be mad at American society, a society that values grossly inefficient vehicles and general waste? If people didn't use so much gas, there wouldn't be such a high price for it. I wonder how many of the loudest complainers are people who drive SUV's or V8 sports cars? They are a far greater problem than the big mean corporations.

Of course, the Katrina hike had to have been more due to the unrelentingly malicious oil barons who would like nothing else than to financially cripple their consumer base than a supply constriction brought about by the hurricane.

How does one define price gouging?

/no, seriously

totalsecurity: Also, as I have said before: if I want to sell my gold for 3 times the spot price, I will. And before someone pipes up and says "gold isn't gas, we need gas..." blah blah blah

The "blah blah blah" part you're leaving out is that gas, building supplies, medical supplies and other assorted things (though notably not gold) are covered by gouging laws. When the governor declares an emergency, the prices charged to consumers are tightly controlled.

So please, keep selling your gold at 3X market price. Maybe you could make an infomercial or sell it to people that buy old coins off TV.

Here's the Georgia law:
http://www.legis.state.ga.us/cgi-bin/gl_codes_detail.pl?code=10-1-393.4

josephstalin
Instead of being mad at oil companies for "price gouging", why not be mad at American society, a society that values grossly inefficient vehicles and general waste?

Instead of...? What, like its some sort of dichotomy? Instead of prosecuting this rapist, why don't you get mad at the murderer down the street. No, thanks, I'll be pissed at both.

And why the hell is "price gouging" in quotes? Do you not really believe such a thing exists, or what?

I'll remind everyone that Exxon-Mobile just announced the single most profitable quarter for a corporation in the history of planet Earth.

Remember, those high prices are because there's a shortage of refineries, not because they're taking advantage of people.

Who's your daddy?

's your daddy, biatches.

Do white/asian dudes and black dudes in that age group actually play Connect 4?

Aias: I am sorry to see the high number of possibly foreign-born owners who did this crap though...

When they hand out business licences do you get told about acceptable pricing?


I agree look at this list. A few noticabily possibly foreign in there.HOwever, most of the cicites (all except Abel if I'm right) are near ATL. Could it be that elected officials only took note after the were given the biz?


Taj International, Inc., Chowdhury, Inc., Rhea Investments, LLC, Peach State Capital, Inc., ARZ, Inc., Coner Shop, Inc.
Saniha & Sameer, Inc., City Shop, Inc., Defoors E-Z Stop Food (Defoors is name of road in ATL), Inc., Tristar Petro, Inc., Yong Kwon, Ali's Investment, Inc., First Class Mart, LLC, Trident Investments of Conyers, LLC, Iquar Enterprises

This is disgusting. People like joesephstalin using any chance they can get to toot their ascetist horn, and right-wingers outraged at their goverment's intervention in... anything.

Oil companies pay for raw materials, and when the price of the raw materials goes up, so do prices. But you won't find an oil exec saying that's the reason why they have record profits. It's not because profit is a straight percentage off the top--it doesn't make sense; profit is about dollars and cents, not percents.

So why did they all have such a bumper quarter? You could ask, why did they *all* have such a great year. This is the thing that's important--how did one not undercut the other to get a bigger share?

And pipe down, when the state of Georgia fines for price gouging, the money at least goes into the state coffers, to reduce taxes or fund more services. That's your frickin check. Furthermore, using high gas prices to wag the shame finger at consumers is missing the whole point. In a hundred years, we will either have full-scale fusion/fission energy economies or we'll be farked. End of discussion. If you want to complain about people who just want to have fun, because you feel like being a holier-than-thou party pooper.

Sergent Tux- the news ran a story on this earlier. They said gauging only occurs during a state of emergency. It's when the state puts a stop on rising gas prices and then random stations charge outrageous amounts. I think there's some percentage equation in relation to what the current price is times pi and then divided by 2. Yup.

And Treefox... it's not gonna happen.

jkmartin: http://www.legis.state.ga.us/cgi-bin/gl_codes_detail.pl?code=10-1-393.4

Thanks for the link, now how does this apply to gasoline? How does gas preserve, protect, or sustain the life, health, or safety of persons or their property? Seriously, for most people gasoline is a luxury that they've come to take advantage of and think of as a neccessity.

2005-11-16 02:56:35 AM jkmartin

Gold used to be controlled by the government. It didn't work out well.

You missed my point where I stated that it is not the poor station owner, but the big multinational oil companies that are screwing people. They are screwing us Alaskans as well.

Building supplies aren't covered by gouging laws. I've sold building stone for a pretty penny, as well as gravel and fine woods.

You are free to find another supplier.

Someone please post the S&D curves. It's so wonderfully reductionist and doltish.

how does this apply to gasoline? How does gas preserve, protect, or sustain the life, health, or safety of persons or their property?

Well, you may see it as a luxury item, but for a trucker, it's a tool of the trade that they can't deal without, and without truckers, our stores would be completely empty, not even shelves. Yeah, I know we can bring food, water, medical stuff, etc in via plane, train, air drop, but it's got to get from the drop off point to the store, it's got to get from the farm/factory to the warehouse, and from the warehouse to the planes, train and ship yards. So I would say that gas would be a a neccessity.

IT COULD HAPPEN !

Great Janitor: how does this apply to gasoline? How does gas preserve, protect, or sustain the life, health, or safety of persons or their property?

Well, you may see it as a luxury item, but for a trucker, it's a tool of the trade that they can't deal without, and without truckers, our stores would be completely empty, not even shelves. Yeah, I know we can bring food, water, medical stuff, etc in via plane, train, air drop, but it's got to get from the drop off point to the store, it's got to get from the farm/factory to the warehouse, and from the warehouse to the planes, train and ship yards. So I would say that gas would be a a neccessity.

5% of people realize that roughly 90% of all goods come in on a truck.

/not real statistics

Look, making ridiculous profit is ok. As long as you spend it all on hats.

"'Price gouging' is nothing more than charging what the market will bear. If that's immoral, then all market adjustment to changing circumstances is "immoral," and markets per se are immoral. But that is not the case. And I don't think a store owner who makes money by satisfying the urgent needs of his customers is immoral either. It is called making a living."
From http://www.mises.org/fullstory.aspx?control=1593
See also http://www.lewrockwell.com/lott/lott45.html

/Too lazy to link.

From the article: "The Governor's Office has released a list of fifteen gas reatilers which have already entered into settlement agreements with the Governor's Office of Consumer Affairs. Some of those businesses have already ponied up fines between $1,000 and $10,000 dollars."

Why are they heroes? This is a drop in the bucket to a gas station. The Governor's office smelled money, and they wanted their cut. Plain and simple. Tomorrow it will be business as usual.

I pissed off a bunch of entitlement idiots here the last time this "price gouging" crap was brought up here, so I'll try not to take issue with any of the specific people posting who have no clue what they are talking about.

But...

High demand is what is driving the current high oil prices, not low supply. We have plenty of oil, for now (although fear of a supply shortage play into the commodity prices). The real problem is that there is too much demand for oil, and not just in the US, but worldwide. This, quite simply, drives the price up. And the US government has no control over this because the forces at work are bigger than the US government (new competition for oil supplies springing up in China, India, etc).

Since the prices are demand driven, demand must be cut. Price controls (which is what anti-gouging laws are) are an ineffective way to curb demand. They actually increase demand for oil here while removing any incentive for suppliers to supply it to us over the buying competition over in China. And this is even more true in an "emergency" where these laws get invoked. You actually need to encourage people to use as little gasoline as possible in an emergency, so that it gets rationed out and not wasted. High prices do that, by making it unaffordable for people (for example) to drive their Hummers during the hurricane evacuations.

The huge profits for Exxon, et al are another issue, and one that is mostly caused by the (government-endorsed) lack of competition amongst the oil corporations. It is government policy that they make that much, and also a byproduct of the fact that these industries live in boom and bust cycles.

Anarcho-Capitalist

Exactly. How can you look at anything that people are willing to pay as being immoral. Think of what someone would pay to say, get a seat on a ship that will get them out of an oppressive dictatorship. I mean, if it's a life savings and the market will bear it, that's not immoral right? I trust you understand this hyperbole illustrates the error in your assertion.

"Oil companies pay for raw materials, and when the price of the raw materials goes up, so do prices."

And yep, there is nothing in the world called demand, or future supply, or basic economics for that matter. So when the news says refineries are offline for a year, you think it's the gas station owner's job to bet against news coverage and assume they will continue getting fuel supplied to them and keep their prices static.

I love how willing people are to take risks with other people's money and livelihood, as though a gas station is just a Department of the Treasury printing press. If you honestly believe that, go wriggle through the regulatory maze, find a location, buy the insurance, secure your supplies, deal with employees and customers who think you're a criminal, and do it all with your own money on the line. And then when the government tells you to put MTBE in the fuel, hire a lawyer to defend yourself for using the MTBE you were ordered to use.

Wow, I wonder why gas is so expensive? I mean, you know, more expensive than air, but cheaper than bottled water. But I need it, so someone else owes it to me, and a pair of testes as well, please, and maybe a change of diapers.

Is anyone fining the news for being off by entire orders of magnitude in reporting without any sources, and causing the hysteria? Is anyone upset that the government kept right on taxing gas at the same rates through the emergency? No, blame the business owners, they force you to buy their gas at the point of a gun.

Go little guy, way to stick it to The Man. And by the way, I know it's illegal, that doesn't mean it's not a stupid law.

sal-paradise: I trust you understand this hyperbole illustrates the error in your assertion.

Actually, I feel it illustrates the error in YOUR assumptions.

If someone was actually able to get people to pay their whole life savings for a single seat on that ship, then there would be a huge incentive for them (or others) to increase the supply of seats to meet the demand. This would cause prices to decrease and eventually more people would be able to afford it. So actually allowing the large profit ends up causing the market to supply more seats and helps more people get out.

# of oil company defenders who've answered any one of the many great points raised by hugechav: 0 and counting.

Now, back to your regularly scheduled bullshiat apologia by roaming bands of freepers.

If I own something, who are you to tell me what I should accept in exchange for it? It's not like someone siphoned off the gas from your tank!

Price controls = shortages.

Mnemia

It's depressing that you both missed the salient point to the arguement posed by the person I was responding to and then proceeded to torture the concept of basic capitalism.

mrexcess: # of oil company defenders who've answered any one of the many great points raised by hugechav: 0 and counting.

I guess I'm not an "oil company defender", because actually I addressed that. The reason they can make massive profits is because they are colluding to keep prices high. And the reason they can get away with this is that our government doesn't give a shiat about enforcing the antitrust laws anymore.

//not a freeper

strobe
If I own something, who are you to tell me what I should accept in exchange for it?

Now, 4 teh non-hypocritical win, apply your logic to the War on Drugs.

Prohibition is the ultimate offense against "free markets". But I don't see any of these freepers complaining. Why is that?

Mnemia: A winner is you, brother.

sal-paradise,
You don't seem to understand that such a seat would be a scarce resource.

I suppose if you're fleeing a natural disaster, the state ought to commandeer your vehicle on the same principle. Sure, you may prefer to choose who you take with you, but I'm sure someone else disagrees who should use your car. Certainly someone running a bus service shouldn't be able to set their own price.

Of course if your MORONIC policy turns out to decrease the number of seats available, I for one would be SHOCKED!

Mnemia,
Anti-trust law would only use the monopoly of the government to further regulate oil companies as public trusts.

The real solution is to stop protecting these oil companies from competition, which is effectively what is going on now by preventing new companies from building new refineries.

strobe

So in a crisis you'd rather see an auction then a first come first served, and you see that as moral?

what the hell kind of people lurk here?